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Is there "Hell" and "Heaven" after life?
in Religion
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If you aren't, Well... To put it simply, You might not even be aware to care that it doesn't exist.
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https://docs.google.com/document/d/1p6M-VgXHwwdpJarhyQYapBz-kRc6FrgdOLFAd3IfYz8/edit
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Regards - Logic
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- Walt Disney
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Heaven on the other hand is usually depicted as some water vapour realm I myself wouldn't want my two feet to step on and live mindlessly for the rest of my life.
All these are simply depictions and interpretations, until a lie detector turns green to someone who states they've seen heaven and hell, I'm not believing in such realms. Thinking of heaven more than your present life is exactly why I'd rather make the most of my time and have something to lose which is my life because it helps to actually pray never but do more.
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That assumes that trying to get into heaven is not enjoyable.
@missmedic
There are passages in Matthew about "weeping and gnashing of teeth"
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To begin, you state that in Revelations, there is a lake of fire where people are thrown in and erased from existence, which proves that there is no eternal torture. For starters, Revelation was written by John, a theologian of the church, John is referencing a critical fact, as the end of time, God will wipe Hell out of existence and all the people inside, but that doesn't mean the torture stops. Heaven and Hell are eternal places, wiping Hell out of existence does not prevent eternal torture. The torture continues, but since Hell is so significantly small in the eyes of God, he can blot out the place while turning to people in joy in heaven.
You mention the gnashing of teeth parable, mentioning that he refers to the sufferings and harm of people who don't do things at all. However, this is precisely what Hell is, Jesus further mentions, "If an eye sins against you, pluck it out so that your whole body does not descend into Gehenna." This is another reference, people who come dressed to the party who are commoners are people who know their place and put on their best to appear fit in the eyes of the kind. The commoners who don't are not prepared and don't understand the caliber of the event, and are therefore tossed out. The people who prepare go to Heaven, the people who don't go to Hell.
Despite how heaven is depicted, no person knows what heaven or hell look like, the representations are symbols for other attributes, like joy, mystery, seeing God, unity. The people can't see heaven, but based off of what heaven is taught to be from the Catholic Church, we can make depictions that represent something we don't understand. For instance, I don't know what the inside of the White House is, but making a depiction is not lying, I am drawing the lavishness of the inside compared to what I know and what I have been shown through previous images.
Hope this helped.
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Imbster
Now you're thinking Jewish! that's great! Our focus is not on contemplating on the hereafter, but focusing all our energies on this world, to make it a better place for our children.
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Great response, you're now thinking Jewish - our goal here on earth is not to contemplate about the hereafter but to focus all our energies on this world, in making it a better place for our children.
WilliamSchulz
You wrote earlier about heaven and hell and how the talmudic view was wrong, I must advise you that you're coming from a Christian perspective, and me, a Jewish one. Of course we won't agree on anything else rather than G-d is divine, and that He created everything we see, even good and evil.
You wrote: "@Judaism mentions that after 12 months in a hell-like area studying the Torah, they can go to heaven. This sounds like the equivalent of Limbo, which I have shown doesn't exist. People who are in hell have made a choice. In life, they chose not to follow God, instead of following their own desires and actions. As a result of their own free will, they choose to be in Hell rather than to be in Heaven with God."
Okay, firstly, Limbo and Purgatory are one of the same, at least I thought so, right? Secondly, you said later in the same post: "As hmans, we are not perfect, but we have to be perfect to get into Heaven. In a place of eternal joy and love, is there place for any hint of sin? No! Therefore, in order to make us perfect, God created Purgatory, a place in which we all will atone for our sins and eventually make it into God's heavenly Kingdom. We are not perfect beings, so God helps us get there, as a way of "atonement for the dead." Even saints had to go through Purgatory, but some can go through faster than others if they led a more virtuous life. Nevertheless, even the murderer who repents can still be in heaven if he makes the choice to remorse of his wrongdoing and be willing to repent for his sins."
I don't mean to debate the matter here, but being Judaism obviously came first, doesn't it make logical sense to claim that your Catholic ideology simple "stole" our concept of hell? That souls must spend some time, in this case, 12 months before entering heaven. You claim the talmudic view is wrong, but then go on to mention Purgatory! It's exactly the same thing just with a Christian spin!
To prove this to us, you make mention of 2 Maccabees 12:44-45, we don't believe it as canonical, and secondly, I believe you've got the context wrong. Sheol is a real place, whether one is Christian or Jew. But the main crux is this: You contradict yourself, you first claim that once in hell, you're there for good, then you lay claim that we can get out of hell. But which one is it, you certainly can't have both! Of course, Christianity is full of such errors.
Shalom
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Great response, you're now thinking Jewish - our goal here on earth is not to contemplate about the hereafter but to focus all our energies on this world, in making it a better place for our children.
WilliamSchulz
You wrote earlier about heaven and hell and how the talmudic view was wrong, I must advise you that you're coming from a Christian perspective, and me, a Jewish one. Of course we won't agree on anything else rather than G-d is divine, and that He created everything we see, even good and evil.
You wrote: "@Judaism mentions that after 12 months in a hell-like area studying the Torah, they can go to heaven. This sounds like the equivalent of Limbo, which I have shown doesn't exist. People who are in hell have made a choice. In life, they chose not to follow God, instead of following their own desires and actions. As a result of their own free will, they choose to be in Hell rather than to be in Heaven with God."
Okay, firstly, Limbo and Purgatory are one of the same, at least I thought so, right? Secondly, you said later in the same post: "As hmans, we are not perfect, but we have to be perfect to get into Heaven. In a place of eternal joy and love, is there place for any hint of sin? No! Therefore, in order to make us perfect, God created Purgatory, a place in which we all will atone for our sins and eventually make it into God's heavenly Kingdom. We are not perfect beings, so God helps us get there, as a way of "atonement for the dead." Even saints had to go through Purgatory, but some can go through faster than others if they led a more virtuous life. Nevertheless, even the murderer who repents can still be in heaven if he makes the choice to remorse of his wrongdoing and be willing to repent for his sins."
I don't mean to debate the matter here, but being Judaism obviously came first, doesn't it make logical sense to claim that your Catholic ideology simple "stole" our concept of hell? That souls must spend some time, in this case, 12 months before entering heaven. You claim the talmudic view is wrong, but then go on to mention Purgatory! It's exactly the same thing just with a Christian spin!
To prove this to us, you make mention of 2 Maccabees 12:44-45, we don't believe it as canonical, and secondly, I believe you've got the context wrong. Sheol is a real place, whether one is Christian or Jew. But the main crux is this: You contradict yourself, you first claim that once in hell, you're there for good, then you lay claim that we can get out of hell. But which one is it, you certainly can't have both! Of course, Christianity is full of such errors.
Shalom
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Practically speaking, if I was a creator of a virtual world, then introducing Hell and Heaven for dead people would seem obsolete to me. When a person is dead, their influence on the material world nullifies, hence keeping them in the database would be a waste of resources, at worst, and an irrelevant complication, at best. If the God existed and wanted to decide what to do with people whose biological forms decayed to the point of unrecoverability, then I could think of many more practical things to do with the corpses and the entities hidden behind their shells, than send them out to abstract dimensions of Hell and Heaven which they can never leave.
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